Jump to content

Welcome to NikonForums.com
Register now to gain access to all of our features. Once registered and logged in, you will be able to create topics, post replies to existing threads, give reputation to your fellow members, get your own private messenger, post status updates, manage your profile and so much more. If you already have an account, login here - otherwise create an account for free today!
Photo

A real head scratcher?


  • Please log in to reply
11 replies to this topic

#1
Tony

Tony

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,516 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationBeaverton, Oregon

Site Supporter

I have been a Nikon supporter for more years than I care to admit.  Overall I truly believe that dollar for dollar, Nikon is the best photography investment out there.  Okay, here is my quandary:  There is a group of us photographers who like to examine anything new that comes to our meetings.  Recently I was looking closely at a Canon (I won't mention the model) with a 28~135mm Canon lens.  I think that is correct on the lens.  I have to admit I was really impressed with the ease of handling and comfort when handheld.  The photos generated by this camera were most impressive to me.  I wonder, were the photos really better or was it a different kind of better? Or perhaps a different kind of color and sharpness, but not necessarily better?  My concern, or trepidation is that after purchasing one of these Canon cameras, would the novelty wear off after a year (maybe less), and I say to myself, Self, this Canon does exactly the same thing my Nikon does, it takes digital photographs.  Would somebody please recommend a good psychiatrist?   :))

 

Thanks, Tony



#2
Thumper

Thumper

    Nikonian

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,289 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationTexas

Site Supporter

For me, I know that my skill as a photographer will never exceed my camera's capability at taking photographs.  (But I won't stop trying).  I can't tell by looking at photographs if they were taken with a Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Sony, etc.  I've seen the range of photos from amazing to awful taken with all brands of cameras.  I believe that it comes down to personal preference.  What works best for you.   What fits you best, or what you enjoy using the most.  

 

I started out with a Nikon film camera (as far as using SLR's) back in the 1980's because the model that I picked at the time had the best features for the price range that I could afford.  I have stuck with Nikon ever since.  I like their products, I like their design, and their cameras "fit" me well.  (Ergonomics, etc).  I have a dear friend that is the same way about Canon.   He is a better photographer than me by a long shot, and not because of his choice of camera brands, but because he has decades more experience (and he is just a damn good photographer, period).  I can hand him, a Canon guy,  my Nikon camera, and he can take better pictures with it than I ever will. 

 

But I keep coming back to "can I tell what brand of camera took this amazing photo that I am looking at?" without being told what camera and without looking at the EXIF data.  I can't look at a photograph and say "Yep, this one just screams Nikon.  This photo was shot with a Nikon. "    Maybe that is my lack of experience there, but I think that with the modern technologies being applied to the current lines of the current manufacturers, it is almost impossible to tell without looking at the EXIF data or by being told by the photographer.  



#3
Merco_61

Merco_61

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,587 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationUppsala, Sweden

Site Supporter

To decide between systems, the best way is to rent equivalent models over a weekend or perhaps for a week and shoot extensively. Approximate equivalents are:

80D — D7200

7DII — D500

6D — D750

5DIII, 5DS or 5DS R — D810

 

These 8 bodystyles have evolved considerably since the D70 and 20D days... The menu systems and sensors even more.

The days when you could see from a file or print which systems was used are long gone. Some lenses have a unique signature, but the difference in bodies is much smaller than the tweaks applied by a photographer who knows his system. Shooting both systems in parallel is a sure way to the looney-bin though, as nearly everything is mirrored. 



#4
TBonz

TBonz

    Sportz Guy

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,652 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationOn A Field Somewhere...

Site Supporter

I agree with both Thumper and Merco.  Way back in the film days I worked at a photo shop...folks were always asking which was "the best"...I always told them it depended on lots of factors...the most important factors being what worked best for them within their budget for what they wanted to shoot.  

 

Over the last few years, lots of folks have said they love my images and asked me what gear / company I used.  Many folks think that more $ means better photos...In some cases they are correct...A 300 2.8 will provide a better image than an 18-300 at 300.  Note that I am not suggesting that the 18-300 can't take a beautiful image - I've seen several...and no, I don't have either lens...I expect that at 300, my 200-400 wouldn't be quite as good as the 300 either but it will be close - I know I tested both and could not see any difference in the shots that I took of the same sport with both lenses.  What it boils down to is the right gear for the photo you want to take and what works best for the person taking the images...because in reality, it is the photographer and not the gear who creates the image...

 

For sports photography, a large part of it is anticipation of the action and part of it is timing by the photographer...and a large part of it is experience - I know my images still have lots of room for improvement but I also know they are quite a bit better than they were 8 years ago...part of that is the gear, but most of that is my learning and desire to improve...

 

I could have shot the image below with my phone or any other camera...

 

slide-0374.jpg

 

...but the gear allowed me to get the image I wanted...I am sure it would have been just as good if I had the equivalent Canon gear...I've heard folks suggest that a great photographer can take a beautiful image with any camera and I totally agree with that but there are some instances (sports being one) where the gear makes it possible to get the best images and I know many photographers who get similar images with Nikon, Canon and even a few other brands...both because they have the right gear for the job and because they are talented and experienced photographers...

 



#5
Tony

Tony

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,516 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationBeaverton, Oregon

Site Supporter

Thanks to everyone for some excellent answers and examples.

 

Tony



#6
deano

deano

    Forum Veteran

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 960 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationColorado USA

Site Supporter

When I first got into todays cameras, I chose the Nkon D90 when it first came out. I looked at all brands, narrowed it down to Canon vs Nikon.  I chose the Nikon as it just felt right in my hands.  I'm sure I would have been as happy with a Canon if it had felt right.  As all have stated above, is it the camera or the operator that makes the great image. A good friend, John Pearce, UK, whom I have known since 1986 was taking great cycling photos then as well as now.  He's a Canon guy.  I think sports photographers also look at the cost of the lens as they can destroy one at any one time, and usually no fault of theirs.



#7
Tony

Tony

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,516 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationBeaverton, Oregon

Site Supporter

When I first got into todays cameras, I chose the Nkon D90 when it first came out. I looked at all brands, narrowed it down to Canon vs Nikon.  I chose the Nikon as it just felt right in my hands.  I'm sure I would have been as happy with a Canon if it had felt right.  As all have stated above, is it the camera or the operator that makes the great image. A good friend, John Pearce, UK, whom I have known since 1986 was taking great cycling photos then as well as now.  He's a Canon guy.  I think sports photographers also look at the cost of the lens as they can destroy one at any one time, and usually no fault of theirs.

Hi Deano, thanks for your response.  I have been re-reading my situation and perhaps I did not come across as clearly as I had intended.  Several years ago, I traded in my Honda Accord for a new one.  I took very good care of the used Accord and trust me, I still kick myself in the caboose for trading it in.  After having the new car for about four days, I started asking myself, self, what the heck did you do?  I am thousands of dollars lighter in the wallet, I still drive the same way to work and back, everyday.  Again, I gave up a very good condition used Honda Accord.  In other words, I have trepidation or fear of once again experiencing buyer's remorse.  Here in the Pacific Northwest we get very tired of driving the same vehicle everyday.  It is called, Getting Car Antsy.  If I were to purchase that Canon and also a few of their lenses, is it me or am I getting Camera Antsy?  As my close, personal friend Lee Trevino would say, "Is it the arrows or the Indians?  I just want to know if anyone else has experienced this same situation.  Clear as mud, right?  Thanks again,

 

Rgds,

 

Tonytee



#8
Jerry_

Jerry_

    Nikonian

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,524 posts
  • Country Flag
Where I live there is a phrase that would likely translate into:

"The grass is always greener in the neighbour's place"

and there must be similar analogies everywhere.

Basically, what it translates is, that, whatever choice you made in the past, you may feel as if you have to reconsider it, because the option that you didn't take would have offered that tiny bit of extra; in the same time you "forget" about all the extra bits that made up your mind for getting where you are.

I think it is human nature - and what makes marketing work.

Thus, while both brands offer excellent cameras, question yourself if it really brings you some benefit.

I think it is the same situation as you describe with the car.

#9
deano

deano

    Forum Veteran

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 960 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationColorado USA

Site Supporter

I agree Tonytee, we all have buyers remorse with a high ticket item we purchase.  Parting with hard earned money is not an easy choice.  As I am in my 70's I have also adopted a new thought process: a few months or a year from the purchase does the initial cost really matter?  Do you use and enjoy your purchase?  My most recent camera purchase was a Sony A6000, $500US.  When I got home with it, I was already having buyers remorse.  But now, a month later, I enjoy the little guy and it does exactly what I wanted it to do,  easy to carry around when I ride my bike, slips into a pants pocket, takes decent photos.



#10
Merco_61

Merco_61

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,587 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationUppsala, Sweden

Site Supporter

If you start by thinking about in what situations your current Nikon and Pentax bodies hinder your creative vision, write them down. When you have a list, read as much as you can about what bodies solve this situation best. You might find that you have more need of better glass or a new body. If that body needs other lenses than what you have, check prices. Weigh the cost against staying with the same system and decide then.

 

Changing systems is always expensive, but only you can say if it is worth it *for you*.

 

Changing systems if you have film-era amateur zooms is easier on the wallet as few of them are up to the task of resolving for a 24 MP DX sensor, so you need to get new lenses even if you stay with Nikon and want something later than the D7000.



#11
TBonz

TBonz

    Sportz Guy

  • Forum Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,652 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationOn A Field Somewhere...

Site Supporter

As Jerry said, the grass is always greener...

 

I got where you were headed with the original question...Basically I look at photography as a series of compromises and compensation.  In the same way that you have to pick the right balance between ISO, SS, and Aperture, you have to pick the right balance in equipment (body, lens, flash, filter, etc.) within your budget to do the type of shooting that you want to do.  While there will be differences in the way they operate and one may do X a bit better while the other does Y a bit better, they still do the same thing...I know a guy who purchased at least one new golf driver a year because he felt that the new one would improve his game...Maybe he was correct...maybe not, but it was what worked for him...

 

Several folks on this Forum have a variety of camera models by a variety of manufacturers...I assume they use them where they feel the camera will perform the best - or, they just enjoy using it - really doesn't matter!  If you want to try a Canon, why don't you rent the setup you are thinking about and try it out to see if it is what you think it is...



#12
Tony

Tony

    Nikonian

  • Premium Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,516 posts
  • Country Flag
  • LocationBeaverton, Oregon

Site Supporter

As Jerry said, the grass is always greener...

 

I got where you were headed with the original question...Basically I look at photography as a series of compromises and compensation.  In the same way that you have to pick the right balance between ISO, SS, and Aperture, you have to pick the right balance in equipment (body, lens, flash, filter, etc.) within your budget to do the type of shooting that you want to do.  While there will be differences in the way they operate and one may do X a bit better while the other does Y a bit better, they still do the same thing...I know a guy who purchased at least one new golf driver a year because he felt that the new one would improve his game...Maybe he was correct...maybe not, but it was what worked for him...

 

Several folks on this Forum have a variety of camera models by a variety of manufacturers...I assume they use them where they feel the camera will perform the best - or, they just enjoy using it - really doesn't matter!  If you want to try a Canon, why don't you rent the setup you are thinking about and try it out to see if it is what you think it is...

Absolutely, this is an issue that all of us at one point or another will on occasion run into newer, more sophisticated equipment.  Let's face it, these companies more than likely currently have their design staff working now on equipment that is slated to be released some time in 2020.  This is true of any OEM.  As my close, personal friend, Lee Ioccoca once said, "If you stand still in the automobile industry, you will get run over."  Well, thanks again to everyone who participated.  Great information to ponder on.

 

Tony