54 replies to this topic

[Wired]

Nikonrumors.com has posted a rumour of an upcoming FX DSLR that will be placed betwen the 610 and 810 in price point, and targeted at sports photographers.

 

So a $2500is FX camera that merges the two together? How do they do this without stealing sales away from other cameras? What do they give us? what do they take away?

 

My theory?

 

D6xx body with minor tweaks, like a proper AF-ON button. essentially taking more of the egronomics of the 8xx frame but in a smaller body

24mp sensor

D810 AF matrix

8fps RAW shooting with a 32-40 frame buffer

dual SD card slots

1/8000 max shutter

1/200 flash x speed

iso 100-64,000

flippy screen *rumored to have it, hence why included)

4k video

 

 

If they built it around the 16mp sensor of the Df/D4s and threw 8fps at it, then I think they would cripple D4s sales.

 

They have to be careful that they don't create a camera that takes the best part of all four cameras and put it into one. From a business standpoint they would have an instant top seller, but it would cripple sales of the other 3/4 cameras.

 

 

What would be ideal?

D8xx body

16mp D4 sensor

Expeed 4 processor

51 AF points

iso 50-256,000

8-9fps in raw with 40 frame buffer minimum

CF/SD card slot or QXD/SD

1/8000 max shutter

1/250 flash sync

Flippy screen

weather sealed

4k video to the memory card

video zebras

full manual video controls

flat video color mode

would someone please put in a full HD review screen? Annoying that my Blackberry from 2-3 years ago has a sharper screen

uncompressed HDMI output

multi-pattern white balance

[TBonz]

I think it really depends on the market they are shooting for...

 

I would think they would stick with fewer AF points and probably native ISO to 12800 and a lower duty cycle.  I would HOPE they keep the 1/8000 shutter speed.  It will be interesting to see if they classify it as a pro body or not - if not, I expect SD card slots and if so, CF and ??? in the second slot...I'm not sure they would put a flip screen on a pro body, so that might tell you something right there if it is included, but you never know...I think the pros would expect more of a D4 body in general rather than D8xx since most of the pro sports folks are shooting D3 or above already.  Most I've talked to also use the voice memo function which I think would be a requirement for them.

 

It will be interesting to see more info on this when it is available.  Might be a perfect second or third body for the pros.

[Wired]

I think it really depends on the market they are shooting for...

 

I would think they would stick with fewer AF points and probably native ISO to 12800 and a lower duty cycle.  I would HOPE they keep the 1/8000 shutter speed.  It will be interesting to see if they classify it as a pro body or not - if not, I expect SD card slots and if so, CF and ??? in the second slot...I'm not sure they would put a flip screen on a pro body, so that might tell you something right there if it is included, but you never know...I think the pros would expect more of a D4 body in general rather than D8xx since most of the pro sports folks are shooting D3 or above already.  Most I've talked to also use the voice memo function which I think would be a requirement for them.

 

It will be interesting to see more info on this when it is available.  Might be a perfect second or third body for the pros.

 

And for the price point I think we are going to be looking at a body designed to be a backup or an entry level professional camera, something more in line with the D800's placement as a high end enthusiast/professional body. I think the flip screen would be the thing they include to "cripple" the camera compared to the D4 series, but will get people to step up from the D600 series.

 

Who knows, maybe we would get a D4 body that is D600'ized with only partial metal frame and not as much weather sealing and crippling on the shutter speed and controls/features.

[iNYONi]

Would this then become the fabled D7** series FX?

[Merco_61]

Or D810H... D710 seems more logical, though.

[TBonz]

That is what I was thinking...an FX version of D300 / D700...maybe the D400 or D500 or D610s?  Soooooo many naming options...Quite honestly, as much as I want the D4s or a second D4.  If they do it soon enough, it is something I would look at VERY closely.  

 

In thinking about it, I would think they might officially make it a pro body if they are going FX with high duty cycles.  If not, it might make sense for them to make it a DX so the pro-sumer could get more reach without having to buy the high end lenses.  Whatever they decide, I am hopeful that they announce it quickly so I can make an informed decision!

[Wired]

That is what I was thinking...an FX version of D300 / D700...maybe the D400 or D500 or D610s?  Soooooo many naming options...Quite honestly, as much as I want the D4s or a second D4.  If they do it soon enough, it is something I would look at VERY closely.  

 

In thinking about it, I would think they might officially make it a pro body if they are going FX with high duty cycles.  If not, it might make sense for them to make it a DX so the pro-sumer could get more reach without having to buy the high end lenses.  Whatever they decide, I am hopeful that they announce it quickly so I can make an informed decision!

 

a pro DX body would for sure be benificial to the lineup, but I doubt Nikon is going to do it. Both Nikon and Canon seem to be abandoning DX format aside from being an entry level and consumer grade system. They don't seem to want to expand this area of their lineup, probably for fear of sabotaging sales of the FX lineup.

 

I know I'm personally very intersted in this new "sports" cameras as whiel I love everything about my D800, I could use more speed, a faster buffer, and I don't always need so many pixels.

[Ron]

I kind of agree that DX is on the way out... or destined to be the new p&s standard. I have no evidence to back that up though... just intuition. 

 

I've heard a few conflicting rumors about this new body. Most of the specs mentioned above are included. The rumors I've seen also add wifi and expeed 4. Until the actual camera hits the market Nikonians will no doubt quibble endlessly about the specs and price point. I'm not sure the flip screen makes much difference in whether Nikon considers this a semi-pro, pro or amateur body though. I remember when the tipping point used to be a pop up flash but the D800 has a popup flash and I doubt if anyone would seriously consider the D800 to be an amateur camera. Especially considering it's price. And, with that in mind...

 

I have a bit of a problem with the expected price point for this new camera. Just what segment of the market is this thing aimed at? The D610 seems to be the low end of the FX line. The Df and 810 in the middle and the D4s in the stratosphere. Perhaps, Nikon sees the Df for what it truly is. An overpriced tribute camera with little actual following. And, I say that as someone who had very high hopes for the Df. 

 

I'd love to join the ranks of full frame Nikon shooters. I've been saving my pennies for an FX body for some time now. But Nikon keeps yanking the carrot... and while the 610 remains just within range I'm still seeing occasional reports from users about sensor spotting issues so I'm a bit gunshy about pushing the button on one of those. 

 

Twenty five hundred dollars US pretty much makes this a non starter for me. Being retired, I have other expenses to consider besides Nikon Corporation's bottom line. 

 

--Ron

[Merco_61]

Ron, while a D610 might not feel like a safe buy and the D810 is expensive, lightly used D700 bodies are not too difficult to find. They are dependable workhorses and the 12 MP sensor gives *very* clean files. Their only weakness is the swelling rubber grip that plagued the D200 and D300 before it, but that is not expensive to fix.

[Wired]

 

I have a bit of a problem with the expected price point for this new camera. Just what segment of the market is this thing aimed at? The D610 seems to be the low end of the FX line. The Df and 810 in the middle and the D4s in the stratosphere.

 

--Ron

 

My theory is that Nikon is seeing many buy the Canon 5D series instead of the D6xx/D8xx because the D6xx is too "prosumer" for "professional" consumption (there are a lot of reasons why I left my D600 in the dust for the D800, and the sensor was only a small fact... the egronomics, button layout, and feature set were the big ones). The D8xx is too slow and has too much resolution for sports and action shooters that don't want to spend $6k on a camera. So they want to come out with something that more directly competes with the 5DMKIII.

 

By that I mean a professional body of the same breed as the D800 featuring professional grade image processor, updated and quicker AF, and a faster shutter speed...but not fast enough to kill the D4s. If it is what I think it is... I'll be buying one.

[Merco_61]

My theory is that Nikon is seeing many buy the Canon 5D series instead of the D6xx/D8xx because the D6xx is too "prosumer" for "professional" consumption (there are a lot of reasons why I left my D600 in the dust for the D800, and the sensor was only a small fact... the egronomics, button layout, and feature set were the big ones). The D8xx is too slow and has too much resolution for sports and action shooters that don't want to spend $6k on a camera. So they want to come out with something that more directly competes with the 5DMKIII.

 

By that I mean a professional body of the same breed as the D800 featuring professional grade image processor, updated and quicker AF, and a faster shutter speed...but not fast enough to kill the D4s. If it is what I think it is... I'll be buying one.

The D700 left a big hole in Nikon's lineup when it got too old (and the batteries were outlawed in Japan) and wasn't replaced. A modernized version that builds on D4 technology makes a lot of sense. If they had come out with a D800H and a D800X instead of the D800 and D800E the 5D would have had much more competition in my opinion.

[Ron]

Ron, while a D610 might not feel like a safe buy and the D810 is expensive, lightly used D700 bodies are not too difficult to find. They are dependable workhorses and the 12 MP sensor gives *very* clean files. Their only weakness is the swelling rubber grip that plagued the D200 and D300 before it, but that is not expensive to fix.

 

I've considered a used D700 in the past but decided against it for some reason or other. I really don't remember now. I know that there are people who wouldn't trade their D700's for anything. 

 

But I really can't do anything until I replace my computer. That comes next but I've been procrastinating on doing it. By the time that happens, this new D710 or whatever they decide to call it, should be out. Then we'll see. 

 

--Ron

[Guy]

On one hand, good news but on the other I say WTF!  That would be too many categories, IMHO.  Already the market people at Nikon cripple cameras to make them "fit a slot" it seems.  If I was running the show, I'd just have a 2 levels of FF DSLRs; namely, amateur and Pro with each being the best you can possibly make a camera in its price range.  Don't hold back on specs on either.  Just make the "Pro"model more rugged, longer lasting and housing feature differences.  But performance-wise pretty equal.  

[Wired]

On one hand, good news but on the other I say WTF!  That would be too many categories, IMHO.  Already the market people at Nikon cripple cameras to make them "fit a slot" it seems.  If I was running the show, I'd just have a 2 levels of FF DSLRs; namely, amateur and Pro with each being the best you can possibly make a camera in its price range.  Don't hold back on specs on either.  Just make the "Pro"model more rugged, longer lasting and housing feature differences.  But performance-wise pretty equal.  

 

I do agree with you, however I hope Nikon is doing something a bit different by creating specialized models instead of a jack of all trades. Ever hear the saying "jack of all trades master at none". What if Nikon has the plan to make the ultimate entry level FX (D610), the ultimate landscape FX (D810), the ultimate reporter and sports FX (D4s), the ultimate low light "Artist" FX (Df), and the ultimate wedding and general portrait FX (D710?)?

 

It's saturating the market, but if they do it right it's giving the right product to the right shooter. I think the 5DMKIII is getting people buying it who don't need the high resolution images of the D810 (and the speed drawbacks associated with it), need more pro features and build that the D610 doesn't have. It's kind of right between the two in terms of feature set and resolution. I won't lie, I almost wnet for it instead of my D800 because its so balanced. but the control layout is not comfortable for me, and that would have ment investing in new lenses.

[Ron]

I sort of miss the days when Nikon had but two SLR cameras. The F and the Nikkormat. LOL

 

--Ron

[TBonz]

It does make sense to have a few "specialist" bodies although I tend to agree that it would be great to have a single choice at each level such as:  entry, enthusiast, prosumer, pro.  The key is that some areas of photography have needs that are frequently the opposite of another area of photography.  The cameras are tools and, especially at the pro level, they have specific equipment needs (and preferences) that will help them do their job to the level of their ability.  And, they do not want to have to pay for other features that they don't need / want.  Although I believe they have WAY too many options right now, it does make sense - especially at the pro / prosumer level - to offer options that are tailored to different specialties.  

 

I am quite sure my D4 or my D600 is capable of producing beautiful landscapes, but I expect I might end up with an even better image if I had all those pixels in a D8xx available.  On the flip side, the D8xx doesn't have the FPS or the low light capability that the other cameras have even though I expect you could get some beautiful action photos with it.  

 

Maybe that is the solution for Nikon...have a very capable, pro level, photojournalist camera, have a very capable, pro level, high pixel camera and then have one that has it all combined into one.  Something like a D6xx / D8xx / D4? where all were same body style, took the same cards and were considered pro bodies.  The internals would be different between them.  Note I'm just using existing model lines as examples, but in many ways, that is the way it is now with the two lower bodies - one more geared at action and one more at still life...

[Guy]

...I hope Nikon is doing something a bit different by creating specialized models ...What if Nikon has the plan to make the ultimate entry level FX (D610), the ultimate landscape FX (D810), the ultimate reporter and sports FX (D4s), the ultimate low light "Artist" FX (Df), and the ultimate wedding and general portrait FX (D710?)?

 

The Df and D610 both have artificially crippled features that keep them from being better.   So Nikon is doing a poor job with these "ultimate specialized models".  

[Ron]

I think one of Nikon's biggest problems is that there are simply too many cameras in the lineup.... especially on the low end.

 

Why on earth do they still manufacture and sell D3200's and D5200's when their 'replacements' have been on the shelves for a year or more. Gosh, I think they still sell D3100's and 5100's. This is ridiculous and only serves to confuse amateur photographers who may be contemplating a first DSLR purchase. Chances are, if you lose those customers, you've lost them for good. Most people can't afford to change camera systems on a whim. 

 

--Ron

[Wired]

I think that's why Pentax partially only offers two cameras right now. Low and high end. But the feature set on both si great

[Ron]

Pentax has been making some really nice cameras on both ends of the line for some time now. I've been very impressed with their offerings. Alas, they suffer from their own corporate craziness in some areas. 

 

--Ron